|
Post by purrfin on May 4, 2023 15:05:12 GMT
I'm rather confused about this new logo/badge on HS. I checked into the membership dues and they were telling me to pay in Lira's. So this association is not based in the States?
Furthermore, why can't we be represented with IPDA badge/logo? Something that is very local but international?
What am I missing?
Okay, I'm done ranting, any further comments about the new logo/badge?
|
|
|
Post by CatnapStamps on May 4, 2023 20:05:08 GMT
|
|
|
Post by ClassicPhilatelist on May 4, 2023 21:03:20 GMT
I recently petitioned the PTS, but they wanted me to provide names of 2 or 3 PTS members for my membership, and I didn't know any, so... I passed.
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 4, 2023 22:36:23 GMT
They are the British version of ASDA (American Stamp Dealer's Association). If they are anything like ASDA, the code of conduct only applies/enforced if you are not part of the "in" crowd. Sounds like a money grab to me. Guess they weren't picking up enough revenue from the 2 shows they run every year. Strictly my non-staff opinion and initial thoughts -- does not imply TTS Admin/Forum sees it this way.
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 4, 2023 22:41:08 GMT
I recently petitioned the PTS, but they wanted me to provide names of 2 or 3 PTS members for my membership, and I didn't know any, so... I passed. References requests are not unusual among the tighter-knit organizations and some of the major auction houses. But usually, it is not a requirement -- just expedites membership or allows you to receive shipment w/o pre-pay privileges. More and more of the major auction houses are tossing no-pay shipment privileges, unless you are a well-established long-time client with an impeccable payment history.
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 4, 2023 22:52:55 GMT
I'm rather confused about this new logo/badge on HS. I checked into the membership dues and they were telling me to pay in Lira's. So this association is not based in the States? Furthermore, why can't we be represented with IPDA badge/logo? Something that is very local but international? What am I missing? They are probably running payment through a merchant processor based in Italy? I've encountered this before when making credit card purchases from European stamp businesses (full-time, brick&mortar). If so, I would be surprised PTS (based in Britain) would use a continental Europe merchant processor. Not all merchant processors accept "foreign" currency, so you are at the mercy of your credit card foreign currency exchange rates/fees if they don't. I don't know what kind of agreement was hatched between PTS and HS, and whether there was any direct financial compensation. But "badges" are a common method of "fund-raising" or cynically -- "revenue-raising". Even Pro-Boards has it. You can arrange "free badges", and you can also arrange badges that must be purchased.
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 4, 2023 23:28:02 GMT
I just checked the PTS website. Looks like Provisional Membership is £180+VAT per year. Wow. After that, full Business Membership is the same, every year.
I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Compare to ASDA (in US$):
$25 Application Fee $275 Provisional Membership (<2 yrs in business) $350 Regular Membership
|
|
|
Post by Dave Sheridan on May 5, 2023 2:49:26 GMT
I'm a member of the PTS, and proud to be so. In the non-American philatelic world, membership carries some cachet and is seen as a big tick for the dealer. I think the annual fee is worth that.
PTS logos are also to be added on Ebay if they haven't been already. The IPDA approached Hipstamp re adding logos, and it would be fair to say that Rosenberg was less than interested.
|
|
|
Post by purrfin on May 5, 2023 10:54:18 GMT
The IPDA approached Hipstamp re adding logos, and it would be fair to say that Rosenberg was less than interested. Dave, that is very interesting. I'm just so leery of joining the PTS as it may seem to be a rabbit hole I really don't want to go down. And with Mark not even giving IPDA a thought is not very nice since many of the members have stopped the bad listings from continuing to be there. So interesting.
|
|
|
Post by fairyfoot on May 5, 2023 11:26:10 GMT
|
|
|
Post by ClassicPhilatelist on May 5, 2023 14:13:54 GMT
khj I gave them references, just noone from PTS. Apparently unless you "know" a PTS member you can't apply to be one. Silly if you ask me. I have incredibly strong references in the industry -- unimpeachable references, but that's not good enough for the PTS.
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 5, 2023 17:25:07 GMT
It's not unusual for the professional dealer associations to put a lot of weight on internal references. Not sure how things are across the pond at PTS and other older dealer associations, but I see a lot of that here in the US.
I remember back in the day at one show, one table dealer who wasn't a regular at the shows I normally attend, was eyeing me nervously as I went through some of his material. Another dealer friend of mine shouted out across several tables "That's..., he's OK". After that, he would bring stuff to me and otherwise leave me alone while I perused.
The reality is, dealer association referral carries a lot of weight. I was fortunate to have gotten into one of the dealer circles, even though I wasn't a dealer. Once you get in, it was no questions asked. During busy times, they would even tell me take it home, add it up, and mail me a check. Also got to hear a lot of stories that normally aren't told openly and are understood not to be told elsewhere -- part of the reason why I tend to be really cynical of the older established organizations.
That being said, there is a good reason that newer organizations such as IPDA gain traction even though there are other much older/established organizations. It's not an issue of how much it costs to join. I used to be so impressed with ASDA, thanks to their advertising/promotion. As the years went by and I understood what was going on and what wasn't happening, ASDA logo meant nothing to me -- I don't take it into consideration when making a purchase or trying out a new dealer. As far as I'm concerned, IPDA membership is far more meaningful/credible to me.
Read all that with several grains of cynical salt...
|
|
|
Post by Ted Talks Stamps on May 5, 2023 18:07:53 GMT
I'm cynical enough to believe that those high membership fees are what makes them less credible. What organization is going to expel a member and forego that kind of income just because of a few ethical lapses?
|
|
|
Post by khj on May 5, 2023 20:57:37 GMT
The cynic in me says, based on my observations over the decades (not of PTS, but on our side of the pond) -- I call it the donut hole (not the health insurance prescription drug coverage, but similar concept): Financial indebtedness <$100, recent new member: we're gonna kick you out, we need to show we are monitoring our membership, you're easy pickings because swindling so little tells us you can't afford a lawyer to sue us, thanks for your previous application/membership fee this year Financial indebtedness >$100K: we're gonna kick you out, but only after you've been convicted and are physically serving time or out on probation; thanks for continuing to pay your annual fees during the years it took the courts to resolve this issue, our lawyer says we've saved a lot of money by waiting Financial indebtedness between those amounts, not new member: you're a big boy/girl, you can work this out, just keep paying your annual membership fees, our lawyer says it's not worth the trouble/expense to investigate, we'll worry about it after it gets past the $100K range and/or you've been convicted/sentenced in criminal court, then our lawyer says kick you out based on what the criminal court rules and after you've swindled millions of $. That's my cynical post for the half-day... my last comment on this particular matter, I've taken this thread off the rails, sorry
|
|
|
Post by ClassicPhilatelist on May 6, 2023 15:38:57 GMT
Yeah, but as an ASDA member, an APS Lifetime member, an IPDA member (of which I gave them multiple references from each group), to be "denied" because I didn't "know anyone" at PTS was just idiotic. I'm well known enough around the philatelic circles as well... it was more than annoying that they wouldn't accept my membership.
|
|